Too much nostalgia online? And other discussions about it

[Cobra!]

I have a mixed relationship with nostalgia nowadays. I used to chase nostalgia any way I could growing up because it felt so good, but now, I guess I’m numb to it. In some ways it even hurts because things I used to enjoy I can never go back to.

There are things I genuinely miss back in the day, such as the “cultural touchstones” mentioned here before, and the fact the only thing connected to the internet, was your PC, through the phone-line.
Buying games was a one-time thing. No extra content to buy (Unless you were The Sims), no day-one patches (unless you were Unreal) and no mechanics developed with the help of psychologists to make the game as addicting as possible. (Indie games are mostly free of this, but most are only on Steam, and rely on constant content updates. Some even have DLC!)
Games back then had to be polished, compelling and, well, fun, from the get go. Though on the flip side, if a game was unstable or glitchy, it was more or less stuck that way.
Also, shoutout to demo discs! There have been noble attempts to bring them back in the indie and homebrew scene (My first game even appeared on a demo disc this way!), but nothing seemed to catch on.

The thing I personally miss the most, though, is the fact technology was still evolving in the home. Many home formats, games consoles, storage standards, internet protocols, and operating systems. People just didn’t know what worked and what didn’t and I loved that.
There is still some interesting new tech, such as the new “flip phones”, the Gemini protocol, and Vinyl video, but it’s definitely slowed down and things are more or less standardised.
I want to keep tech from the days of old working and preserved for other to enjoy for years to come but it feels like an uphill battle, as the vast majority just want to have everything run off flash memory now.

Not to mention tech nowadays is built in such a way that you can’t open it up and fix it if it’s broken. You either need to pay for a new unit, which is bad for the environment, or you need to pay a premium to get someone from the company in question to fix it for you because only they have the tools to fix it. Gotta love Capitalism…

Another thing I’m not a fan of nowadays is just the sheer amount of content out there being overwhelmimg, but on top of that, only a tiny fraction of that has any substance. You have videos on SoMe that are the media equivalent of empty calories. Just soulless and meaningless crap! Says a lot given we all probably sat in front of a TV for hours back in the day!

Nostalgia has been used to create the work we ourselves feel nostalgia for today. 2000s stuff being clearly inspired by 1980s things, for instance.
Now, though, it feels so blatant and it feels like companies just exploit it nowadays, with half-arsed reboots or sequels that wouldn’t have a leg to stand on if it weren’t for some nostalgic IP attached to it.

Of course, growing up I had to deal with going to school 5 days a week, which I hated, and not having the independence I have today to go out and do what I want. Though school, college and university forced me to talk to people and make friends, something I just can’t seem to do today. (I don’t think it’s social anxiety, I can talk to people when I need to, I just have nothing to say)

I think the biggest things that would stop me from living in the past if I could, are the progress we’ve made politically in terms of acceptance, tolerance, and progressive political movements (Though it could be argued that we’re starting to go backwards on those now), and things I’ve achieved on a more personal level.
I had a dream a couple of years ago that I was transported back to the 2000s, and the main feeling I got was frustration. I had spent years at that point finishing my first commercial game, and going back means all of that progress has been lost. It felt like if you lost a save on a memory card for a game you were playing through and have to go through it all again.

For me, the nostalgia isn't necessarily the "frutiger" and all that. For me, what I actually miss, is how stuff works.
 
For example, where I live, there is no longer any FM radio. FM radio doesn't exist here anymore (sans 1 local tower i can barely get any reception from.) So if I just want to turn on a random FM radio and chill, nope. I'd have to get expensive DAB, but reception is awful and if it wont connect to our Wi-Fi (so I cant have it in the garden) the reception will most likely be crud.

Same with TV. I grew up with having a small TV in the kitchen and one in my bedroom. But "cable tv" here is not a thing anymore. So if I want more than one TV (with signal), I have to have an extra TV-box reciever +tv channel card for each TV, etc etc. A whole damn ordeal and wires and equipment, and insanely expensive on top of the already expensive cable.

There was something so casual and calm about waking up and putting on the TV in the kitchen, hearing the weather presented, random news or some ye olde cartoon or Gunsmoke episode lol. Just bliss. Now I have to actively sit down and keep my hand on my phone if I want the weather/news at breakfast. I hate it.

Same with my bedroom TV. Just channel hopping before bedtime, riding the channel waves until I fell asleep.

Now I gotta use like a chromecast, find something either on Youtube (and have ads with 300% louder volume that sometimes crash the app), or use like a streaming app and actively flick through it until I find something and just ohhhh my GODDDDDDDDDDD.

Its supposed to be "easier" but it just gets annoying instead.

Not to mention, TV used to be good. There were always some fun comedy/action/thriller/horror movies on Thursdays, Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays, on like 3-4 different channels. Then there were the friday night specials on some channels. Monday, Tuesday and Wednesdays were sometimes like drama, historic pieces, tear jerkers, romance and such.

They hardly even show movies on TV anymore.
 
They'll show like 17 episodes of Pawn Stars on one channel, 3 channels will send different "house renovating" shows nearly 12 hours straight, 2 or 3 channels will cram in some low budget "reality" (nobodies/"influencers"/d-list celebs) dOiNg sTufF for the lols, or like the same people in quiz/game shows etc. Just absolute trash.

With video games and retrocomputing at least, people actually revive old services. Dreamcast and OG Xbox games are actually playable online again! People are doing pretty cool stuff with Cybiko, Windows 9x and Classic Macintosh, giving them practical uses again. I can see people making their own pirate radio stations to give FM Radios something to tune into again. Heck we’ve had consumer tech to do this for years. I remember VWestlive did a review on a device that did this for AM radio.

Modern tech becoming a chore to use actually has a name: Enshittification. I think these companies know they have a monopoly, and can push things further and further, safe in the knowledge that we’ll use their products regardless, since we don’t have a choice either way.

I also feel like I'm having trouble finding cool new fun stuff online, as a lot of the stuff in the web revival scene is just personal and 'self education' websites (i.e. Online Spyware Watchdog, FSF, etc). If there are any ways to find cool new stuff, do tell me!

Wiby, a curated search engine
Marginalia, a search engine that prioritises non commercial sites
Marginalia's similar site finder
Marginalia's site explorer (it's not working at the time I'm writing this however)
brisray's webring list
Neocities' activity page. It's usually fine these days but the ToS is fairly loose.
Nekoweb's activity page

There is also the Gopher and Gemini internet protocols, both great spaces to explore pages!

[DiffydaDude]

I kinda like the nostalgia kids have for the 2000s. It's nice seeing things I liked back in the day, especially old tech make a comeback. The historical inaccuracies with the culture online do bother me though.

Dont get me wrong I like nostalgia too, I like seeing people make stuff with the old stuff and appreciating the stuff we did back then, but it feels a little anachronistic sometimes. Like the whole thang with the badly named frutiger aero is a little obsessive on their reddit page. I actually did ask where the name Frutiger Aero came from, the best i got was that apparently, the Segoe font is inspired by the frutiger font? no idea how true that is. apparently the resurgence was also started by some photographer who liked taking vintage style photo shoots.

[DiffydaDude]

I have a mixed relationship with nostalgia nowadays. I used to chase nostalgia any way I could growing up because it felt so good, but now, I guess I’m numb to it. In some ways it even hurts because things I used to enjoy I can never go back to.

There are things I genuinely miss back in the day, such as the “cultural touchstones” mentioned here before, and the fact the only thing connected to the internet, was your PC, through the phone-line.
Buying games was a one-time thing. No extra content to buy (Unless you were The Sims), no day-one patches (unless you were Unreal) and no mechanics developed with the help of psychologists to make the game as addicting as possible. (Indie games are mostly free of this, but most are only on Steam, and rely on constant content updates. Some even have DLC!)
Games back then had to be polished, compelling and, well, fun, from the get go. Though on the flip side, if a game was unstable or glitchy, it was more or less stuck that way.
Also, shoutout to demo discs! There have been noble attempts to bring them back in the indie and homebrew scene (My first game even appeared on a demo disc this way!), but nothing seemed to catch on.

Another thing I’m not a fan of nowadays is just the sheer amount of content out there being overwhelmimg, but on top of that, only a tiny fraction of that has any substance. You have videos on SoMe that are the media equivalent of empty calories. Just soulless and meaningless crap! Says a lot given we all probably sat in from of a TV for hours back in the day!

The thing I personally miss the most, though, is the fact technology was still evolving in the home. Many home formats, games consoles, storage standards, internet protocols, and operating systems. People just didn’t know what worked and what didn’t and I loved that.
There is still some interesting tech that exists today, such as the new “flip phones”, the Gemini protocol, and Vinyl video, but it’s definitely slowed down and things are more or less standardised.
I want to keep tech from the days of old working and preserved for other to enjoy for years to come but it feels like an uphill battle, as the vast majority just want to have everything run off flash memory now.

Not to mention tech nowadays is built in such a way that you can’t open it up and fix it if it’s broken. You either need to pay for a new unit, which is bad for the environment, or you need to pay a premium to get someone from the company in question to fix it for you because only they have the tools to fix it. Gotta love Capitalism…

Nostalgia has been used to create the work we ourselves feel nostalgia for today. 2000s stuff being clearly inspired by 1980s things, for instance.
Now, though, it feels so blatant and it feels like companies just exploit it nowadays, with half-arsed reboots or sequels that wouldn’t have a leg to stand on if it weren’t for some nostalgic IP attached to it.

Of course, growing up I had to deal with going to school 5 days a week, which I hated, and not having the independence I have today to go out and do what I want. Though school, college and university forced me to talk to people and make friends, something I just can’t seem to do today. (I don’t think it’s social anxiety, I can talk to people when I need to, I just have nothing to say)

I think the biggest things that would stop me from living in the past if I could, are the progress we’ve made politically in terms of acceptance, tolerance, and progressive political movements (Though it could be argued that we’re starting to go backwards on those now), and things I’ve achieved on a more personal level.
I had a dream a couple of years ago that I was transported back to the 2000s, and the main feeling I got was frustration. I had spent years at that point finishing my first commercial game, and going back means all of that progress has been lost. It felt like if you lost a save on a memory card for a game you were playing through and have to go through it all again.

With video games and retrocomputing at least, people actually revive old services. Dreamcast and OG Xbox games are actually playable online again! People are doing pretty cool stuff with Cybiko, Windows 9x and Classic Macintosh, giving them practical uses again. I can see people making their own pirate radio stations to give FM Radios something to tune into again. Heck we’ve had consumer tech to do this for years. I remember VWestlive did a review on a device that did this for AM radio.

Modern tech becoming a chore to use actually has a name: Enshittification. I think these companies know they have a monopoly, and can push things further and further, safe in the knowledge that we’ll use their products regardless, since we don’t have a choice either way.

Wiby, a curated search engine
Marginalia, a search engine that prioritises non commercial sites
Marginalia's similar site finder
Marginalia's site explorer (it's not working at the time I'm writing this however)
brisray's webring list
Neocities' activity page. It's usually fine these days but the ToS is fairly loose.
Nekoweb's activity page



There is also the Gopher and Gemini internet protocols, both great spaces to explore pages!

Sorry but imma be honest, this is the kind of stuff i get sick of hearing, like ive heard this exact stuff over and over again and im also sick of that word, enshittification, like i dunno how reasonable im being but that word is so damn annoying to me for some reason

[wygolvillage]

Not entirely true. A lot of it came as a push back of abuse issues in fandom spaces. Certain fandom spaces got really bad, and with the rise of Tumblr and people talking more about social issues, being critical over fiction was seen as apart of the solution. It absolutely was co-oped though.

As a former Tumblr power-user I gotta agree with this.

Back when I was more discourse-immersed I was on the "anti" side, and most of us were teenagers or young adults reacting to seeing other (fictional) teens/children being sexualized. I've seen people make the claim before that "oh antis were started by conservatives" or "antis are all secret conservatives" which I think is absolutely not true because, like, I was there, it was DEFINITELY leftist infighting. I think anyone can end up falling into "politics of disgust" because disgust is a very visceral emotion... Especially if, like, you see something that makes you maybe feel unsafe and are then treated unkindly due to taking issue with that, or whatever. I think a certain amount of compassion should be extended on both sides since it's an issue that can be very personal to people and that can get nasty very fast. (Like, I feel this way about slur reclamation discourse too, reclamation and avoidance are equally valid ways of dealing with trauma, but people somehow got it in their head that only one is correct and the other way is regressive or harmful. Actually a lot of discourse was like this.)

I also think generally a lot of discourse/infighting is a reaction to, like, the state of the world kind of sucking. Like, an individual twitter user can't singlehandedly end climate change but getting an Argument Win Online makes them feel like they've accomplished something (compounded by how anger = engagement on these platforms). Like, I remember tumblr's discourse culture started getting really really nasty around 2016. I think it's absolutely a misguided attempt to feel in control and like you're winning when the world is spinning out of control. Callout posts made to make you feel like you've slain the dragon and ousted the Bad Person, etc

Nowadays I err more on the "censorship of art is generally bad even if that art squicks me out" and "maybe arguing about this in today's political climate where a lot of the language used has been co-opted as an anti-lgbt dogwhistle is Bad Actually" side of things but I also just... don't read enough fanfiction regularly anymore for me to bother having a horse in the shipping race.


Oh, whoops. That was an entirely off-topic ramble. I just find online culture really interesting to talk about 

[arcus]

Dont get me wrong I like nostalgia too, I like seeing people make stuff with the old stuff and appreciating the stuff we did back then, but it feels a little anachronistic sometimes. Like the whole thang with the badly named frutiger aero is a little obsessive on their reddit page. I actually did ask where the name Frutiger Aero came from, the best i got was that apparently, the Segoe font is inspired by the frutiger font? no idea how true that is. apparently the resurgence was also started by some photographer who liked taking vintage style photo shoots.

The term Frutiger Aero was coined by Sofi Lee in 2017, as a combination of Aero and the Frutiger typeface, which was popular with corporate materials of the time.

From Wikipedia.

I haven't seen anyone being obsessive over Frutiger Aero. I don't use Reddit, though.

Oh, whoops. That was an entirely off-topic ramble. I just find online culture really interesting to talk about 

It's really interesting how things have changed over the years. There needs to be more places documenting it.

[grubbyfox]

yeees @dirtnap lol  And as mentioned already, yes, I keep forgetting the word enshittification, haha but that is so true.

I remember back in the 00s, I would daydream about just playing "anything" on a TV screen. Just putting .avi files and whatnot on something and plug into the TV. Or just "send" something to my TV. That was my dream.

And I have that now, except I have to have like 7 different things for it to work. Cant cast from every app, smart TV can only play a certain type of files, wont add subs to everything, even if provided,  but does on some files? idk. Smart TV doesnt have all apps, and some apps can only stream to chromecast but not to TV, or PS. Cant have cable on more than one TV in the household, and the list goes on, lol it's just aggravating now    - And that's assuming it even works. For months, one streaming app I had would wonk out and disconnect from chromecast constantly after 17 minutes (adroll), and youtube would disconnect from both chromecast, tv and PS4 for like 6 months after every ad-roll. Gah!!

What I liked about old times (lol 00s) was that I could just... have a TV in the kitchen and it would have signal. I didn't have to sit with my phone in my hand, as mentioned.  Feels like I got what I dreamed of, except not really and in exchange I had to give up what I already had, haha.



This short video touches upon a similar issue (not exactly the same scenario but the gist of it)

(invidious link for those who dont like yt) https://yewtu.be/watch?v=cvDGqAtNzUc

I sometimes watch it and have a giggle, cause its so real lol

[tarraxahum]

This is a bit off-topic, but until this moment I haven't even realized that just normal TV programming is fading away.

Where I live it's still very much present and both my grandmas have those kitchen TVs that play whatever, but the quality of the signal is fading every year due to analogue technology. Huh. I wonder if new apartments even get the antennas installed anymore.

We do still have a wide variety of normal FM radios here too, in very good quality at that, but now that I know there are places where both these things are just non-existent... I'm kinda spooked! I am already complaining left and right about the fact that I can't play videogames I supposedly "own" without like five launchers and an internet connection, you're telling me the casual TV and radio stations are also dying out? Whack!

[DiffydaDude]

i think im gonna go ahead and close this thread cuz i can tell the topics goping towards that whole 'enshittification' discussion, so im just gonna close it here since theres already threads for that. At this point i dont even know what the point of this thread is. Am I looking for answers? some kind of comfort? am i just annoyed with people? i dont know :(

[Paprika]

Well it's interesting to see people's view on nostalgia at least, this is why boards exist, to discuss and see each other's opinions !

As for me nostalgia is indeed a double sided coin and I complained for a very long time that everything was terrible, etc etc. But now I'm more in peace with myself. I know that in 15/20 years I will have nostalgia of today and so forth with the rest of my life. And it's perfectly fine.

Nostalgia can be enjoyed but you don't need to have the rose-tinted glasses, not everything was perfect and I believe it"s rather human to have a feeling for what was perceived as simpler times (I insist on perceived).

As long as you don't end up in a flood of negativity, nostalgia can perfectly be enjoyed by everyone. I like the times I live in and I like the times I lived in, both have their appeal and charm. Keeping it balanced is healthy !

[bees]

yeees @dirtnap lol  And as mentioned already, yes, I keep forgetting the word enshittification, haha but that is so true.

I remember back in the 00s, I would daydream about just playing "anything" on a TV screen. Just putting .avi files and whatnot on something and plug into the TV. Or just "send" something to my TV. That was my dream.

And I have that now, except I have to have like 7 different things for it to work. Cant cast from every app, smart TV can only play a certain type of files, wont add subs to everything, even if provided,  but does on some files? idk. Smart TV doesnt have all apps, and some apps can only stream to chromecast but not to TV, or PS. Cant have cable on more than one TV in the household, and the list goes on, lol it's just aggravating now    - And that's assuming it even works. For months, one streaming app I had would wonk out and disconnect from chromecast constantly after 17 minutes (adroll), and youtube would disconnect from both chromecast, tv and PS4 for like 6 months after every ad-roll. Gah!!

Wait, for real? I thought this was doable just hooking up something like an old laptop to a TV. We had a similar setup for a while, though that wasn't my doing, and I've considering doing it again but it's not a priority for me. I thought with stuff like wifi and those smart accessories for TV it would be even easier now! Shows how much I know about TVs, heh.

[grubbyfox]

I have a mixed relationship with nostalgia nowadays. I used to chase nostalgia any way I could growing up because it felt so good, but now, I guess I’m numb to it. In some ways it even hurts because things I used to enjoy I can never go back to.

There are things I genuinely miss back in the day, such as the “cultural touchstones” mentioned here before, and the fact the only thing connected to the internet, was your PC, through the phone-line.
Buying games was a one-time thing. No extra content to buy (Unless you were The Sims), no day-one patches (unless you were Unreal) and no mechanics developed with the help of psychologists to make the game as addicting as possible. (Indie games are mostly free of this, but most are only on Steam, and rely on constant content updates. Some even have DLC!)
Games back then had to be polished, compelling and, well, fun, from the get go. Though on the flip side, if a game was unstable or glitchy, it was more or less stuck that way.
Also, shoutout to demo discs! There have been noble attempts to bring them back in the indie and homebrew scene (My first game even appeared on a demo disc this way!), but nothing seemed to catch on.

Another thing I’m not a fan of nowadays is just the sheer amount of content out there being overwhelmimg, but on top of that, only a tiny fraction of that has any substance. You have videos on SoMe that are the media equivalent of empty calories. Just soulless and meaningless crap! Says a lot given we all probably sat in from of a TV for hours back in the day!

The thing I personally miss the most, though, is the fact technology was still evolving in the home. Many home formats, games consoles, storage standards, internet protocols, and operating systems. People just didn’t know what worked and what didn’t and I loved that.
There is still some interesting tech that exists today, such as the new “flip phones”, the Gemini protocol, and Vinyl video, but it’s definitely slowed down and things are more or less standardised.
I want to keep tech from the days of old working and preserved for other to enjoy for years to come but it feels like an uphill battle, as the vast majority just want to have everything run off flash memory now.

Not to mention tech nowadays is built in such a way that you can’t open it up and fix it if it’s broken. You either need to pay for a new unit, which is bad for the environment, or you need to pay a premium to get someone from the company in question to fix it for you because only they have the tools to fix it. Gotta love Capitalism…

Nostalgia has been used to create the work we ourselves feel nostalgia for today. 2000s stuff being clearly inspired by 1980s things, for instance.
Now, though, it feels so blatant and it feels like companies just exploit it nowadays, with half-arsed reboots or sequels that wouldn’t have a leg to stand on if it weren’t for some nostalgic IP attached to it.

Of course, growing up I had to deal with going to school 5 days a week, which I hated, and not having the independence I have today to go out and do what I want. Though school, college and university forced me to talk to people and make friends, something I just can’t seem to do today. (I don’t think it’s social anxiety, I can talk to people when I need to, I just have nothing to say)

I think the biggest things that would stop me from living in the past if I could, are the progress we’ve made politically in terms of acceptance, tolerance, and progressive political movements (Though it could be argued that we’re starting to go backwards on those now), and things I’ve achieved on a more personal level.
I had a dream a couple of years ago that I was transported back to the 2000s, and the main feeling I got was frustration. I had spent years at that point finishing my first commercial game, and going back means all of that progress has been lost. It felt like if you lost a save on a memory card for a game you were playing through and have to go through it all again.

With video games and retrocomputing at least, people actually revive old services. Dreamcast and OG Xbox games are actually playable online again! People are doing pretty cool stuff with Cybiko, Windows 9x and Classic Macintosh, giving them practical uses again. I can see people making their own pirate radio stations to give FM Radios something to tune into again. Heck we’ve had consumer tech to do this for years. I remember VWestlive did a review on a device that did this for AM radio.

Modern tech becoming a chore to use actually has a name: Enshittification. I think these companies know they have a monopoly, and can push things further and further, safe in the knowledge that we’ll use their products regardless, since we don’t have a choice either way.

Wiby, a curated search engine
Marginalia, a search engine that prioritises non commercial sites
Marginalia's similar site finder
Marginalia's site explorer (it's not working at the time I'm writing this however)
brisray's webring list
Neocities' activity page. It's usually fine these days but the ToS is fairly loose.
Nekoweb's activity page



There is also the Gopher and Gemini internet protocols, both great spaces to explore pages!

I really like this post!    and I agree, I prefer living in today, lol. I think you touched upon a lot of good points about why some of us feel "nostalgic" in lack of a better term.

Its not necessarily that "everything was better before", but a lot of things have def spun out of control

[Cobra!]

I forgot to add, another thing I really miss, probably more than the stuff I mentioned before, are relatives and loved ones who have since passed.

Growing up with an Italian family, it was tradition for us to meet with extended family for lunch. Every Sunday, we would go to our gran’s for this. One of us would bring a games console and play whatever the hottest game at the time was, games like Tekken 3, WWF Smackdown, the Timesplitters games, and anything with Tony Hawk in the title.
Most of all, it was just a way to catch up with one another.

Our gran passed away in 2021, and all of that stopped. Her house was sold, and we stopped the regular meet ups. We drifted apart and now we barely see each other at all, and it’s had a serious effect on my mental health. The only thing that helps is the fact I still have dreams of being back there, getting up to whatever.
I guess it goes back to a point I did make before about not being able to make friends. I have nothing to fill the void that was created in 2021.

I really like this post!    and I agree, I prefer living in today, lol. I think you touched upon a lot of good points about why some of us feel "nostalgic" in lack of a better term.

Its not necessarily that "everything was better before", but a lot of things have def spun out of control

I wouldn’t say I would rather live in today, necessarily. The perfect world for me would be me being me, but life having elements from the past, and what it did better.

Sorry but imma be honest, this is the kind of stuff i get sick of hearing, like ive heard this exact stuff over and over again and im also sick of that word, enshittification, like i dunno how reasonable im being but that word is so damn annoying to me for some reason

What stuff are you referring to, exactly?

I get your point about the word enshittification, but unfortunately it’s the only word that describes what is going on with big tech.

Speaking of, I saw a video talking about how bad subscription services in particular are nowadays. Makes me glad I never feel for these as I valued owned everything I purchased, and still do.

Maybe I should make a new thread about this, actually.