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Author Topic: Is it ok to give up on the web-revival?  (Read 1781 times)
Icey!
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« on: May 07, 2023 @119.48 »

.

Admins note: The original poster has removed the original post.. please don't do this! I didn't have a backup of it. However for context, the topic is a discussion about feeling unsure about fitting into the wider web revival scene.

OP's note: The reason why I removed the original post is because it made me look like a person who dreams to be popular on social media which is an image that I don't want around on the forum. Maybe I could have edited it to be less intimidating? But the decision has already been made, no undo.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2023 @399.49 by Icelogist » Logged



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« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2023 @146.33 »

The concept of web revival is cool, but its kinda hard to be fully revived because its really only there for that niche of people who miss that blog feel, people are very used to the quickness of social media like instagram, But in a way, the niche that ARE interested in web revival and these kinds of things are pretty cool and do genuinely use it
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« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2023 @177.06 »

I’ve never had the slightest interest in the web revival. I just wanted an affordable url to do what I wanted and neocities was the only way I could do that.
Ppl are drawn to the community because of it’s creative freedom. But as soon as it becomes typecast and hivemindy it stops being creative. That’s why I’m sure the web revival thing will burn out and become vapid pretty quick.

Do what’s interesting to you. Do the thing you want to do that no one else wants you to do. That’s what will last. Screw what the community thinks a website should be. What’s the difference between the ‘web revivals’ unwritten  narrow restrictions and the narrow restrictions of the social media titans they say they’re against?

If your art isn’t fun for you anymore, it’s probably because it’s not your art anymore; it’s what you think your supposed to do to be excepted.
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« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2023 @207.20 »

If it makes you feel any better, I do feel somewhat a sense of belonging in the web revival community but I still keep tabs on modern-day social media myself! As someone who does eventually want to make successful content on the web , especially as an artist its.. hard to avoid not using things like Instagram or TikTok  :tongue:

That is to say, there is good and bad in everything! Prioritize most on what makes you happy and accomplished. I really think it's a great idea to branch out more for your game by the way :-) You are doing the best you can do with what you're given and i'm proud of that.

Eventually i'm planning on reopening an art account on sites like Instagram and.. *gritting my teeth when i say this* twitter.. yes, you heard me. So I don't think people will think of you lowly at all, If you're considered about social media addiction consider getting an app that sets screen time for yourself and that way you can make concious and good decision on the time you're using when it comes to the internet!  :ozwomp:

That is all I have to say, TL;DR: Yes! It's okay to give up on the web-revival if its not for you  :4u:
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« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2023 @423.66 »

I think you can do what you want and still be part of the forum and still have a website :) being active on these doesn't mean you're into the web revival and it also doesn't mean your website has to be looking old. And look at Melon, and how he has built a community that is also interested in his works while active in this space, on neocities. I think it is possible.

It's fair and valid for artists to use other social media sites, after all many other artists are there; and the allure is big, because there are so big artists there who have built their presence there for years. Though I think there has to be a little caution involved in regards to expectations, because when we see all these big artists on there, it's kind of a form of survivorship bias? We only see the big ones, not the ones struggling or who have given up, we only see them big now but not all those years they were barely having any followers. We only see the ones the algorithm decides to give us, not the ones that are being outcast by the algorithm for not gaming it or not fitting in. We have to ask ourselves, would the algorithm punish us or reward us for what we put out there? Can we handle not getting an audience for years? And even then, you might be getting an easier following on these sites in terms of numbers, but are they really interacting with you and and your content? Are they commenting, playing the games, clicking on the shop? So many people on these sites are passive consumers who just scroll through a feed. Not to mention that so many artists in the last year have been fed up with Twitter and Insta for hiding their content more and more; especially on Instagram, artists have seen a sharp drop in engagement because content has been replaced with showing ads.

The following is my own opinion and you might share it or not, but I think some content is best presented in its own little space, its own capsule, instead of being one entry in a feed. Some things in someones feed can make your content look worse or boring, but you can't control what else people are following, and you can only game the algorithm so much until it isn't art that you wanna make anymore. That is why I prefer my stuff (by now) to be within its own context and stand alone.
You also have to think about the audience of your stuff. Are the people you think would be most interested in your content on these platforms, and then where on it? For some things, it might be better to be off social media and meet your potential fans where they are. But that depends on your content and target audience.

I can't answer any of that for you or other artists wanting to get their art out there, but this is worth considering before heeding the siren call of these platforms, tbh.
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« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2023 @498.62 »

Yes. Number one rule: Do what makes you happy.

You need not explain yourself to others in any capacity, only if you so wish. At the end of the day, you should focus solely on making yourself happy and comfortable. Regardless of how that looks, that's all that matters!
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« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2023 @614.57 »

@Icelogist You've been asking this question over and over in different ways since you first joined 2 years ago  :tongue: Im not sure you'll ever get the clear answer you're looking for its always gonna be a grey area for you. I don't mean to be presumptuous, but I feel like, the fact that you're asking these questions means that you get what I (and I hope others) are trying to do here, which is - question the role the web plays in our lives and make it better.

I have to admit I've also been doing some soul-searching recently - it's not 2021 anymore, I'm getting older, the YW is gone, and after a 2 year golden age of new updates to my own site I'm starting to feel like I need a break again (I think I'm gonna focus more on my games too!)

I agree and disagree with some of the points above. Mainly, doing what makes you happy is not actually correct - you can be in a bad relationship and still be happy. Happiness is just one part of the equation for a good life. Like success, failure, sadness, joy and anger - they are all just passing imposters, but what they add up to together is real.

Let's get to the root of it all though! The web revival is not about making retro websites, and it's not about quitting social media, it's not about using Linux/FOSS, it's not about self-hosting sites, it's not about being on this forum, it's not even about making blinkies or adding noses to your emotes :^S (although many of us do those things)

The web revival is about optimism and confidence in technology; it's about believing that the web can be a genuinely positive tool, that we as humans control. It's a web where anyone can make a site however they like and have it become whatever they want it to be, a community, a hub for their art/games, a blog, a badge collection or the start of a movement. It's a web that raises people up by making them proud of who they are instead of crushing them down with cringe culture or conspiracies. A web that's not ruled by 5 big corporations, and not ruled by capital, investors or market analytics. It's one little bit of the web that says "Yes, we can make it work because we love it!".


It's not easy, and it won't make you a millionaire, and it won't make you famous. However, it should at least be fun  :ok:

I'm a little scared by how many people in the comments here seem to be happy to distance themselves from that; Im not sure who's to blame for that mentality, maybe no one. However, it should be clear, there are no restrictions, and there is no wrong way to want to have hope; just don't give up hope that the web can be better, because it can if we make it better  :ozwomp:
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« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2023 @817.89 »

@Melooon Keep in mind that I am very young, about the youngest member of the forum. So it's very well possible that I am just going threw things. I often repeat the same questions to cope with my thoughts to have someone out there to confirm that "everything is fine". Yes, I understand that it get repetitive after a while but I do need it. Other wise I will just fall into never ending dread again. I don't have a therapist.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2023 @950.12 by Icelogist » Logged



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« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2023 @865.31 »

I think your doubts are understandable then. I didn't know of your age before, but that explains the lack of connection to older web, while experiencing a lot of pressure to be on social media not only for artist reasons, but also peer reasons and simply growing up with it being normalized. Not being on there is often portrayed as this death (or shall I say deaht :smile:) sentence for your social life and career, and the fear of not being on there holding you back must be hard. So many your age or younger have career plans to be popular on all these platforms because their idols have been the most successful instagram influencers, YouTubers or Twitch Streamers for years, or peers get their own TikTok careers going. I think it might be easier for us older users who remembered a time before social media to know success is possible outside of it, than for someone who has always grown up with social media like this. I mean, ~2008.. that's only 2 years away from the big socials boom 2010-2014.
So don't fault yourself for having doubts or needing reassurance, it must be a difficult to navigate that in your position, potentially even the pressure you usually get in that time by school, parents, etc etc to decide NOW what to do with your entire future and getting the feeling you already have to lay the groundworks for your future career or build a nice portfolio or CV. I can't fault you for trying to do the right thing and asking yourself how you can grow in this climate. I hope you can find the reassurance you need.
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« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2023 @73.32 »

To me, the Web Revival is about the fun in making websites and doing other online projects like reviving tech like Swatch time, reviving old online games or creating cool spaces like this forum!

I avoid social media myself for more than just principle. I was genuinely miserable when I was on them and was addicted, and experienced a form of withdrawal when I stopped using them, and made a thread here about it.

One thing I would love to do more is just sit down and explore the web and smolnet, since I realised I haven’t in a while, and always feel like I never have a good time to sit down and do that.

That said, switching my daily sites from social media to forums like this has gotten me down the occasional expedition through links people post!

One thing that definitely keeps it all fresh for me is that I set the new tab and window sites on Firefox to the Wiby surprise link so I always see new and interesting sites!
« Last Edit: May 08, 2023 @75.54 by Cobra! » Logged




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« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2023 @145.42 »

I'm a little scared by how many people in the comments here seem to be happy to distance themselves from that; Im not sure who's to blame for that mentality

That’s a good point. I think people like me who never quite fit in are drawn to communities that say they’re about inclusiveness. Then we develop an ire for those communities when we still don’t fit in. That’s probably a personal insecurity issue more than anything.
Maybe the web revival should put less emphasis on nostalgia and be more focused on looking forward to a better, future web. If that was the case maybe less people would think of it as a niche and wonder wether or not they’re doing it wrong. 
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« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2023 @197.73 »

After reading threw some of the replies I feel that I may have gotten the concept of the web-revival wrong, I originally believed that the web-revival was about reliving the early web in the present day. Cus, that's pretty much what it says on the melonland wiki: https://wiki.melonland.net/web_revival.

Seeing the amount of responses saying that it's "more about being able to do what you want" vs "we are going back in time to using Email for everything" feels like a more promising definition. However, the problem I have is that the majority of the user base is mainly interested in using more old fashioned ways of doing things or at the very least things they have more control over. What if I don't want to use an Email for everything? What If I want to use Discord instead? Can you see why I felt so left out?
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« Reply #12 on: May 08, 2023 @223.07 »

I originally believed that the web-revival was about reliving the early web in the present day. Cus, that's pretty much what it says on the melonland wiki: https://wiki.melonland.net/web_revival.

I honestly felt that that's what the web-revival movement was all about, too. But the longer I've been in this community, the more I've realized that it's exactly what @Melooon said. Sure, there are people who believe that using the internet with older technology is best or the way to view certain websites is the absolute definitive way (mobile viewer haters is a personal gripe of mine :ohdear: ), but I've kind of taught myself to go about how I want to be a part of this community.

What if I don't want to use an Email for everything? What If I want to use Discord instead? Can you see why I felt so left out?

I absolutely understand what you mean. There was a topic posted somewhere here before of someone having trouble leaving Discord because it was their main form of communication with online or IRL friends; and I definitely felt the same way. But there was a reply that stood out to me (I think it was also @Melooon :ok: ) that using modern-web social media is okay. There were some other reasons behind that topic, but that's besides the point.
I believe that it's okay to use a modern-web social media platform, like Discord, if it's your preferred way of communication.

I hope you'll be okay with all this soon :) :4u:
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« Reply #13 on: May 08, 2023 @281.94 »

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« Reply #14 on: May 08, 2023 @358.58 »

So let's go for the flesh.

You can do, whatever you want or don't want. You can use Discord. You can use E-Mail. You can make your own website by hand. You can use some framework or website building kit. But live with the consequences (advantages and disadvantages) of that!

My personal Windows 98 stoneage approach to the web feels tolerated on this message board, and I can't expect anything more beyond that in 2023. Not everything was better 25 years ago, but IF something was better, name it! And use it for your benefit.

But that's a decision, that you have to take. You have to know, what you want. Something, that becomes clearer with age, I'd say. Nobody can dictate you, what to use. Yet! Let's hope it stays that way and the options out there against the big companies web will stay afloat. But you have to make your own way. And nobody on this message board can dictate you, what to do. Especially no hillibillies with their Windows 98 machines.
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