Dealing with people who do use social media?

[Melooon]

There's always a lot of discussion here about how bad social media is, and I think most of us on this forum have either partly or totally exited social media sites and we are very pleased with ourselves 

However, I had an incident today that made me realise how much of a minority this mindset still is. There is a local zine fair near me that I knew absolutely nothing about! I could not find any info about it, or any proof that it existed, or basic info like when or where it was happening, let alone info like how to sell zines at it.

None of that information was available anywhere outside of Instagram; no website, no email, no ad in the local free ads section; only Instagram.

Its really frustrating because Id love to have been involved in a zine fair; but as it stands I feel excluded and frustrated by the whole thing and I am not even sure I feel welcome visiting it.

All this is to say; the spaces we inhabit define us and they become part of who we are; by being trapped outside of this particular bubble I felt like I as a person was unwelcome in my own society; that particularly stings when zines of all things should be the most inclusive of spaces!

I suppose this is something people encounter; how do you manage it on a personal level and what can be done on a wider communal level?

[shevek]

It's indeed a problem. I encounter the same issue with restaurants - they often have given up on having their own website and post solely to social media, which often is inaccessible without an account, especially Instagram Stories where they announce specific deals, events, or even their temporary closure.

If something on social media is important to me, I bookmark it, so for the future I can manually check it. If it's behind a login wall, I usually ask others to check it out for me. I often actually hear about events and all that through others who still use social media and act as a filter for me.

But I think being away from it is sort of its own filter too, so missing out on stuff is actually the intention/the point. It sucks feeling excluded like in your case, but I wonder if it would have fit your vibe at all, or vice versa. Limiting it like that is a conscious or subconscious choice for the people who organize it, which to me means a specific stance around internet and social media that permeates the event and the audience it attracts. That can mesh smoothly with your stuff, or it doesn't.

It has the potential to attract a diverse crowd, of course, but to me, many things exclusively limited to very shallow socials often attracts people who don't get having no socials at all, making websites without marketing in mind, who think it's icky, a red flag, weird, who bring the sort of social media vibe to an event (very vague here, but I don't know how to describe it) and it can feel like they're only there to make a good Insta story picture.
This isn't to say that all events and things you miss out on would automatically have sucked anyway, but I think some can. Especially if they may be centered around the expectation of boosting your socials that you don't have, just as an example.

I see it the same with people. I've been left alone or dropped by people who were awful who otherwise would have always stalked my socials because it would have been easy to do so. Or messaged me on there all the time. But no one wants to use SMS or a message service they don't have yet, and they don't wanna send email either.
Otherwise, when people ask for it, I just say I don't and if they ask why, I explain. And if they try to convince me to remake some, I keep my distance.

[starbreaker]

I don't cater to people who insist on using social networks like Twitter, Facebook, etc. They're the ones who get lonely. I'm immune to loneliness, because I grew up lonely and eventually stopped feeling it. So other people can interact with me on my terms, or not at all.

And, frankly, I don't have any respect for people who still use Twitter. Having an account there hasn't been a good look since 2016, and it's only gotten worse in the last year or so.

[wygolvillage]

That zine fair story sounds so frustrating. My pet peeve is when that kind of thing is hosted on social medias that don't allow people without accounts to view posts and content, which is becoming more and more common. (including instagram afaik)

Social media may be seen as "the most accessible" but with the way these websites are today they're becoming more and more like walled gardens.

This topic reminds me I was offered a Blue Sky code by my dad lol... I was flabbergasted, I'm pretty vocal about not liking twitter

(I am still technically a "social media user" but I'm planning to kick the habit next year. I've been using blocking apps to gradually reduce the amount of time per hour I can use tumblr (down to 5 minutes as of december) so I hope I will be able to kick the addiction fully.)

[Gans]

Damm, not even a single contact person / contact e-mail somewhere? Usually, people who organise these things help you if you ask them like "could you send me some infos via e-mail?". It should be worth the investment for them, and if it isn't... well bye then, mainstream!

But maybe you could get a "proxy", some other zine maker who goes to that specific event, to give you some information. At least to know when the event will take place? There you could talk to the people (old-school!), maybe get to know the organisator as well, have a chat. Are they really that unopen, how it looks from the view of us forum nerds? I guess not. Probably just unaware of their choice of communication channels, that's all.

It requires some undesirable extra effort, not nice at all. But it should be possible to get to the result, if it's really worth it.

[brisray]

I don't use Instagram myself, but if you're interested in this poster, or any other, why not just look at their posts once a week/month whatever. You don't have to look at any other account on the platform if you don't want to.

[wygolvillage]

I don't use Instagram myself, but if you're interested in this poster, or any other, why not just look at their posts once a week/month whatever. You don't have to look at any other account on the platform if you don't want to.

AFAIK trying to scroll through an instagram account without being logged in will result in a popup nagging you to log in, and you won't be allowed to continue.

[grubbyfox]

AFAIK trying to scroll through an instagram account without being logged in will result in a popup nagging you to log in, and you won't be allowed to continue.

Yep, you cant look at Instagram without being logged in. Same with Facebook I believe, and I think Twitter also started using this feature at some point? At least when viewing in a browser on mobile.

A lot of apps want to build walls around their information, because it's better for them to have people register and sign in, than for people to scroll "for free". 

I know the frustration. Here in town you can barely go on a bus without having to download an app and whatnot. I used to be able to just scrape together some coins to hop on a bus. Now, it's a whole ordeal. I think they need to have the money-option because minors are taking the bus. But it's still frustrating!! I used to keep this tiny, slim and non-invasive booklet of bus-schedules in my wallet/jacket, and either one of this bus cards where they clip each fare or just pay etc. (depending on how often I took it.) Easy peasy, didn't need my phone, and app, a debit card or whatever.

Last winter, I passed a woman waiting for a bus, and the schedule at the bus stop was missing or something (I dont remember). She didnt have any battery on her phone and asked me if I could check the bus schedule for her online.    I had to go to this wonky website and download and open a PDF... download a pdf... to check schedules. (Lest I install an app I guess? It didnt say.) Just, why.. I was standing there late at night in winter time trying to download a darn PDF, lol.

Anyway, that was kinda off topic.

But yeah, I absolutely hateeee when I hear "Oh! Well, we wrote it on our Facebook" or something, when there's info that could have been either in-store, on a website, flyers, or whatever. Like, I get it...but it's so..gah, sometimes I just wish Facebook was wiped off the internet forever. I hate that it's basically just a marketplace for companies now, it makes no sense. The name Facebook doesn't even make any sense considering it's basically just a place for companies to gatekeep their info.

[di]

Lately I've come to accept that - although I wish this weren't the case - social media is simply where a lot of people are.

Marketers, artists, and activists, all alike, flock there because they want to reach people. And while I wish people used social media more like auxiliary channels, for a lot of people/organizations their FB/Instagram/Twitters are their main channel for updates.

I live in a small town and Facebook is where the council and townspeople communicate what's going on. I wish we collectively chose a platform that wasn't so problematic, but somehow we were herded there.

It's part of mindless consumerism. People want what's easy because oftentimes they genuinely don't have time to think of alternatives. That's rarely any fault of their own; they need to work and take care of their families, but building a site comes with a learning curve, forums are antiquated, and Mastodon - well, it's just too "different" from the Brand-name.

Of course, those factors don't scare everyone off. In the case of zinesters and artists and activists, many of them do see flaws in the system, but they are complying with it because reach is important for their needs.

I'm surprised that your local zine fest only used social media to advertise it, and I'm sorry you missed it, but I rather agree with Shevek, maybe it's a sign you wouldn't have vibed with it!

Nevertheless, now you do know it exists and you should try to figure out the next time it's happening. Don't get mad, get even! Zinesters are open to new ideas - make, print, and distribute flyers/zines at the next fest to help educate them on the Web Revival and why they should join!

[Cobra!]

I have a lot to say on this topic..

I’ve also had things that I didn’t know about because they were only announced on social media, but it’s actually been getting better recently, with the places I frequent adding calendars on their websites, and some even with ics downloads!

Though this is still a conversation I have all the time with people.

“Oh you should check y out! It’s on Facebook!”
“I don’t use Facebook”
“Why not?”
“Locked out of my account”
“Why don’t you unlock it?”
“Not worth it.”
“Why don’t you make a new one?”

Like, dude… take the hint.

That said, I have been able to convince my family to only contact me via phone, text or email. Including extended family.

I don't cater to people who insist on using social networks like Twitter, Facebook, etc. They're the ones who get lonely. I'm immune to loneliness, because I grew up lonely and eventually stopped feeling it. So other people can interact with me on my terms, or not at all.

I feel the same way. Have never really had any meaningful connections, like, ever. Not had any serious hardships growing up, but I’ve never felt close to anyone, not even my own family.

I still crave connection and such now and again, but I’ve mostly just learned to live without.

I don’t think social media has ever helped that side of things. I feel like social media isn’t about being social, but rather it’s about making you addicted and shoving ads in your face or collecting data to sell to advertisers to shove stuff more relevant to you in your face. I think it’s about as helpful for socialising as sugar is to prevent tooth cavaties.

[Swiftpaw]

This is a regular problem for me with Facebook. Almost every local group uses Facebook, but I don't (and probably can't because of issues with privacy and being transgender), so I can't really access any of their information.

There are a couple groups or events near me which thankfully have mailing or text lists, but I think as it stands Facebook and other social media is just the method more people know about and people might not even realize that mailing lists are even still a thing.

If you want though, for Instagram at least you can browse Instagram profiles without being nagged by a login wall with Imginn.

[wangobangy]

This frustrates me, as someone who likes to be kept up to date on things I enjoy. I used to have Twitter on my phone just to get post notifications from accounts. I want to know what's going on with my favourite bands, updates on games from the developers. If only newsletters were still popular, then I wouldn't be in the dark on these things. 

[starbreaker]

If only newsletters were still popular, then I wouldn't be in the dark on these things.

This is how I feel about RSS feeds, but everybody and their cat wants my name and email address.

[Onio]

As to your particular circumstance, I would go anyway! You know about it now and I'm sure limiting their reach by advertising only on Instagram wasn't a practice in exclusion. If you do go, and if the opportunity arises to mention such things, you can always bring up how lucky you were to find out about the event since you don't have Instagram, and that could potentially lead to discussions about the Indie Web, your values, and your online practices.

Unfortunately, social media is - for better or for worse - how most of us are interacting now. Most people don't realize there are options outside of large social media platforms that dominate online discourse. What benefits, enrichment, and experiences are those people, whose social experiences are largely shaped and confined by social media, missing out on? Nonetheless, I see more people growing weary and leaving it behind day by day, especially as the conditions on platforms worsens, and more people openly and actively advocating against it (like Jaron Lanier). 

I think the current sacrifices are worth it for many. From experience, I've missed out on many events I'd liked to have participated in simply because I had either left the common platform that would have connected us, or I had just never learned of the platform. It's just something we have to acknowledge, that there is a real chance that we'll miss out on certain events and opportunities if we close certain doors. But surely the benefits of closing those doors outweigh what they had to offer us.

Does it have to be this way? Well, I think of it as an opportunity in itself. Not for "othering" social media users, nor "othering" those who have chosen to withdraw from the social media game, but for bridging the gap and showing people real alternatives that are genuinely refreshing and engaging. For me, the world of personal websites is far more exciting, interesting, charming than their social media counterparts, and I know there have got to be many more people who would be excited to connect and explore "new" and "fresh" (for them) methods of online engagement that have yet to discover the Indie Web, or realize that anyone is active on it.

At the end of the day, to abandon social media is going against the flow, and when we're stepping out of that social synchronization, we.. well.. become less synchronized with many social communities - again, for better and for worse. You miss out on some of your favorite things from other people, but you also miss out on a whole lot worse. The cool part is that you have a voice, a choice, your creativity and skills, and the understanding that as more people are repeatedly exposed to alternative modes of online social connection, awareness and adoption can continue to grow (especially if you're able to spark genuine curiosity and interest!)

[bingus_baby]

With social media, it is what it is. There's no way to fight it as far as I know. For years I stayed off social media as much as I could, but eventually gave in because I missed my friends. Sure I can DM them on Discord, but being able to passively keep up with friends cities away is important to me. And finding restaurant menus, grand openings for new places, etc. is also worth keeping it around. Also, less important, everyone thought I was a freak for not having accounts there. I don't know if anyone have experienced this, but caring about privacy and being less online isn't normal to most people. My parents think I'm on some Rusty Shackleford shit when I talk about data miners.

In short, it's about balance for me. I can't escape it, but I can tame it like a wild horse. I won't die from having a Twitter account that I don't post on.